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Astrology Questions and Answers => Astrology Questions and Answers => Topic started by: paloma on January 30, 2007, 09:13:51 AM

Title: Two basic questions (and more on Chiron)
Post by: paloma on January 30, 2007, 09:13:51 AM
Dear Eric & team:
I have two basic questions on my chart.
1) What would you figure is my "role" or mission in life?  Being almost 46, many accomplishments to show, I feel I may in a near future approach a time to develop something new and perhaps more meaningful.  I wonder what that is.
2) Broken heart - Long love story, started in 1978 - what is happening now that has a relation to that?  It "sarted coming back" in June 5, 2004.  I don't know if I could be insisting in something that's finished or about to innaugurate a new chapter of the story.

Thanks a lot for any possible insight.

Love and light, Silvia O.

Title: Re: Two basic questions (and more on Chiron)
Post by: paloma on January 30, 2007, 09:54:12 AM
Dear Silvia,

In 1978 Saturn was transiting your seventh house of relationships, conjuncting Uranus on your descendant, and opposing Chiron on your ascendant.

What you are experiencing as a 'come back', is really one; Saturn is now making a return to this position; it is, for a second time, transiting your seventh house and therefore conjuncting Uranus and opposing Chiron, again.

Chiron tends to show us where some hard lessons tend to repeat themselves in our lives, so we can learn. In a case like yours it sounds like an opportunity to study and learn from the past and make new and positive choices using your own experience as a guide.

But when we say learning, what are we pointing out to?

With Chiron, learning is a dual process. This duality comes from it's connection with the energies of Saturn and Uranus. Chiron's orbit crosses both Saturn's and Uranus' and it is said to function as a bridge between these two different dynamics.

So, in Chiron, we have the Uranian way and the Saturnian way of learning. Some sort of crisis, change, challenge, confrontation, experience happens and has to be dealt within the moment, in the present (it can be an illness, an accident, a relationship crisis, an unexpected career shift, etc.) ; and then there is the digestion of this experience, that needs time to set in, that needs time to be applied as a lesson (and the changes it brought). One of the combinations of the dual quality of Chiron is for example, that Uranu will bring the 'unexpected' and sudden quality of the experience, and then, the Saturn experience will be the restructuring process that follows this change. Or, the Chiron experience brings immediate insight (Uranus) and we need to work hard to solve the problem we've grasped (Saturn). This process is called awareness.

Another quality Chiron presents to us, is that once we have taken in it's lesson, we become it's teachers. We translate our experience into something that can be expressed and shared. Chiron brings the necessary transformation to makes us active participants instead of passive victims of our destiny. By making our experience available to others we embrace our journey, we accept who we are and the path we have taken.

This is why we so often use the metaphor of the 'wounded healer' to portray Chiron's archetypal energy. It's basic argument is: i need the experience of my wound, and of healing it, in order to make healing available to others; because, how can i communicate it if i have no direct (first hand) experience of it? So Chiron's learning process has less to do with books, schools, theories, and has more to do with the individual and subjective experience of knowledge and wisdom. This is Chiron's core, as it brings to the surface the issue of power and authority ; with Chiron we learn to be our own authority, that is, only by applying constant awareness do we know ourselves, and therefore can we heal ourselves. The helpers and teachers on our path are like us, collaborators, nor less, nor more.

Your natal Chiron conjuncts your Ascendant and opposes Uranus conjunct the descendant; and both Uranus and Chiron are squaring your Sun in the 10th house. My first take on this placement is to ask you what is it that you really want in life (or what is it that you have always wanted and haven't got), and how have relationships blocked, disrupted, challenged your higher ambitions? By this what i am trying to say is that what appears to be two questions coming from you, one related to your role and mission in life, and the other to a relationship, are actually one. To put it in another way, there is a strong connection between the way you relate to others and the way you connect with your goals and life's mission. What happens when you make these two questions into one?

From question one: I feel I may in a near future approach a time to develop something new and perhaps more meaningful.  I wonder what that is.
From question two: I don't know if I could be insisting in something that's finished or about to innaugurate a new chapter of the story.

Both phrases have the word new in them.

When i think of new, i feel air, breathing, freedom, lightness, youth, creation, energy; i get a sense of movement, of wonder, a AH! So, what is thit AH! thing that is asking for expression? Do you want to step into the new? If something, what is blocking you from doing so?

Saturn's transit is usually one that will bring some past influence into the present so we can experience the emancipation process of letting go of unnecessary patterns and outmoded structures and influences that create limits and blocks in our life. It's transits points out to specific lessons that need our maturity and wisdom to be dealt with. When talking about a second Saturn transit like yours, one that is impacting a high energy dynamic as Uranus opposing Chiron on the ascendant/descendant axis, we are talking about a major life opportunity to learn and grow and  to reformulate questions and to bring more awareness to who we are, and what we really want to give and receive.

So looking at your chart i am curious about two specific moments in your journey, and i wonder if you would be willing to share with us what was going on in your life. One is during Chiron's opposition to your natal Chiron, in 1993, specifically in August; and the other is Chiron conjunct your Sun after having crossed your midheaven and squared Uranus and Chiron; this in 1999, specifically, November. In both instances i am curious to learn about what was going on in your relationships and your career.

I say, let's take this energy field of Uranus/Saturn/Chiron to take some steps backwards, just a bit, so we can take a good look (or jump) into the future. The new can be scary, but it is so exiting.

Looking forward to hear from you!


Title: Re: Two basic questions (and more on Chiron)
Post by: paloma on February 04, 2007, 06:14:36 AM
Hello dear readers, here is Silvia's reply; she has written a longer version for me. When replying, i will quote some of her in-depth text. Thank you Silvia, for sharing and for the trust you have deposited on us. Back to you soon!

Dear Paloma,
Answering your questions, in Oct 26,1993 I gave birth to my first child, a boy named Andr

Title: Re: Two basic questions (and more on Chiron)
Post by: paloma on February 08, 2007, 02:55:31 PM
Dear Silvia,

First i want to thank you again for sharing your life's account and your deeply rooted questions; my first take when i read you for the first time was, what a an intense soul! I feel there is a raw untamed creative bold energy vibrating in the core of your self, that has been in the background, while you were living a life that feels to be full of conditionings, limitations, responsibilities. And i feel that you have shown your strength and power, you have gone through a long phase of struggles that have given you the weight of maturity and wisdom, but that a part of yourself have been kept in the background, repressed, unexpressed, alone, and that now, something is happening, ready to be shifted so you can revert this situation and make your soul's needs prominent; and i add that all you have struggled with and learned can and will work in your favor to make this change happen. You need it, you want it.

What is read as a call for love and relationship, is in reality just a level of something deeper. That encounter you are seeking with a man, a lover, a friend, a partner, is a mirror manifestation of a relationship with yourself. You have to find yourself first, in the mist of a lifetime dedicated to survival and the needs of the others. Only after meeting yourself you will attract the situations that will reflect and vibrate to the level your soul is asking. Loving yourself (learning to) should be your main concern at this time.

So we are going to go deeper. I propose we look closely at your story and find the inner story hidden behind the life events you describe. This is a bit like detective work, we will digg, and try find the core aspect that needs to be seen, addressed and healed in order for you to move on, out of the patterns that have trapped you in a life that feels incomplete. Going back is not about judging our life as a series of errors, but more as understanding why we made the choices we made.

I've made a choice of specific paragraphs from your narration, and i have highlighted the phrases that have triggered my interest; i think that taking these paragraphs and phrases out of context will help us read the other story. Then we will look at the astrology to see where it all fits in the chart. For the reader's benefit i want to clarify that Silvia has written a very long and intimate account of her life; i am only posting the relevant parts to this discussion.

I will continue tomorrow; here are Silvia's words:

When I was between 17 and 18 years old, i.e. 1978, in January or February, my father had the first of a series of thrombosis, that would render him disabled for ten years, until his death. In March I went to college to start my first BA.   At some point close to the middle of the year or at the beginning of the second semester, I met a musician named Paulo for whom I fell head over heels.  I met him at the University, and though he was not a student there, he was always around, as he had several friends who studied there.

About a year and a half later, after many problems, Including my family

Title: Re: Two basic questions (and more on Chiron)
Post by: paloma on February 09, 2007, 03:18:36 PM
Man is split. Schizophrenia is a normal condition of man--at least now. It may not have been so in the primitive world, but centuries of conditioning, civilization, culture and religion have made man a crowd--divided, split, contradictory.... But because this split is against his nature, deep down somewhere hidden the unity still survives. Because the soul of man is one, all the conditionings at the most destroy the periphery of the man. But the center remains untouched--that's how man continues to live. But his life has become a hell. The whole effort of Zen is how to drop this schizophrenia, how to drop this split personality, how to drop the divided mind of man, how to become undivided, integrated, centered, crystallized. The way you are, you cannot say that you are. You don't have a being. You are a marketplace--many voices. If you want to say 'yes', immediately the 'no' is there. You cannot even utter a simple word 'yes' with totality.... In this way happiness is not possible; unhappiness is a natural consequence of a split personality.

Osho, Dang Dang Doko Dang Chapter 3

In your answers and in your life's account we can see a struggle, conflict, polarity; initially you brought up two questions that seemed to be separated: one is your life's mission and the other a relationship. The picture of this polarity is clear: two energies, desires and needs that are pointing to different directions. One wants and needs to achieve a set of external and specific goals (career, recognition, material success) and the other needs and wants intimacy, love and depth in a relationship. Having one way would signify the denial of the other. This only causes frustration and a deep sense of incompleteness, because we are meant to have it all. We need to find the unity behind the split. So i say, instead of addressing the issues of career and love, lets go deeper, and see where this split started, where is this conflict coming from. Only by going at the root, can we find the solution. This is called healing; healing is making whole.

Reading your text i find a repetition in relationship with protection, security; sacrificing love and art for career goals; parental influence; and a deep wound in your sense of worth and self love.

(I wanted to be able to have my own house and car; my apartment remained closed and unfinished.  My mother did not accept to baby sit at any time. Some months after we started dating my mother and I had one of our horrible fights and I decided to move into my apartment with him and A, then four years old; I made an agreement with my sisters to go live in my mother

Title: Re: Two basic questions (and more on Chiron)
Post by: paloma on February 12, 2007, 02:40:10 PM
Well, after this long introduction, maybe i can try to answer your question.

Your chart has a strong Capricornian signature; Saturn rules and is located in your eleventh house, with Venus, Jupiter and Juno. This give you a strong sense of duty and responsibility with a special orientation to groups and collective efforts; your Aquarius ascendant is ruled by Saturn (ancient rulership, and by Aquarius, modern); this gives you a dualistic approach to your social role. On the one side, you have a  conservative approach; your are perceived to be serious and reliable, and on the other side, you have a transgressive energy, a quality that searches originality, freedom, expression; your Sun in Saggitarius brings an expansive quality behind your ascendant's mask; your essence is optimistic, adventurous and joyful; you a truth seeker, and your contribution to the world comes from a heartfelt desire to be part of something substantial and far-reaching . You want truth and justice for all, and you have the inner structure and power to achieve this.

Jupiter, your Sun's ruler is in Capricorn, toning down your natural impetuousness (Saggitarius); this combination brings a constant sense of expansiveness and contraction in your inner energy. You Aquarian rebelliousness is well accompanied by the Saggitarian need to conquer space, to advance, to open doors to the new and feel the inner passion that comes up when we are free to be; with such a strong signature in Capricorn i would suppose that the restrictive impulse is stronger than the expansive one, or to put it in another way; you need to have strong and safe structures, and to function and make decisions based on duty and safety. There is a tension here that might make you feel restless, frustrated and irritable at times, as the boiling passion of your Sun was constantly tamed and limited by your Saturn energy.

A similar tension is present in other aspects of your chart; for example, Saturn conjunct Venus in Capricorn in the eleventh house opposes Mars in Cancer in the fifth. Venus desires to express it's deep need of affection is somehow repressed by Saturn's energy; it brings a sense of unworthiness (Venus rules our sense of self value) and a holding back of your real feelings as a protection for being hurt and rejected (Saturn's effect). The opposition with Mars polarizes this situation by holding these emotions inside instead of expressing them; this leads to a deep frustration and underlying anger. In this context Saturn might represent one of your parents, who's authority, early sense of limitation, and judgment (probably your father) repressed your passionate nature.

Mars in Cancer the fifth house wants a protective nurturing lover, one who responds to your need of emotional support; it also connects your sexual desire to the need of security and protection. The Moon being the ruler of your fifth house brings a strong connection between this unexpressed anger and your mother; maybe the void i mentioned before in my previous post is projected in the kind of lover you need, one that has a motherly quality. The fifth house is the place we tap into our creative expression,  where we enjoy being and expressing who we are. (I believe there is a strong connection between your musical talents being repressed and then projected into musicians).

To answer your question i would say the first and most important thing for you to do would be to nurture this non saturnian aspect of your chart. When i say nurture, i mean open space in your life to a creative outlet, something that feels like fun, that feels young, that feels just for you, out of any sense of duty and responsibility.

I say imperatively find a creative outlet for you passionate and romantic nature. You need to take care of your Venus and your Moon, your feminine loving self, your self nurturing quality ; before considering any external change, i would suggest investing time and money only on you and your woman, on rebuilding a relationship with yourself, your SELF. Find your essence, give it room to breath and be.

The changes we desire to achieve in our life, must start on a deeper place; that is, we need to make space for the new from the inside. Your Venus in Capricorn has a dry quality to it, therefore, you need to water it's earth often. What would this water be for you? What would feel like softening the heavy capricornian limits? I say ART. Be it dancing, singing, ritual making, be it cooking (you have Ceres conjunct Chiron near the ascendant, are you into food? or have you used food as a hidden outlet for your sense of lack?). You need to commit to develop the aspects you have somehow sacrificed in the search of material security.

I say, while doing this,  invest some time and money in any form of therapeutical process; you need to address your parental influence and release the anger; in order to step into the new, we need to let go of the past; for this we need to name it, work on it.

Think about the lover you need. What woman do you think you want to be with him? One that is the boss, the provider, the healer, the person in charge? Is that the woman you are? What do you have to offer?

On the vocation front i say the same thing. What do you have to offer? Who do you want to be and serve? Do you have time and money to invest in exploring some creative outlets and studies that might end up being a business, or a professional project that is more fulfilling? Are you willing to use your Capricorn qualities to serve your creative desires instead of denying them?

You might discover that you have a special talent that could benefit many; how would you find it without exploring, playing, trying. For this, i give you a two year time frame in which you could immerse yourself in a personal exploration and healing process; your Chiron return (2009) will bring a special opportunity to  reinvent yourself: and i say, get ready, you have time.

I want to finish saying that there are no mistakes in life, only lessons, and that by opening space for the expression of your essential self you will realize that all you have lived and gone through have given you power tools; your life experience will be incorporated into the new, this is how Chiron works, this is how the wound becomes the medicine. I can only say that with such a strong placement of Chiron in your personality sector you are meant to ground your essence and to make it available as a healing energy for others; you Capricorn signature in the eleventh house , and the Sun in the tenth, will become allies of this process, and once you have found yourself, i can see nothing stopping you from making it happen.

Let us know how it goes, and i want to thank you again for sharing your process with us.